Just don't follow the herd. Chose what you like. For me, concrete5 does the trick because of the frontend live editing. You have blocks which you can use from the core, or you can make your own, which you can use anywhere. There are some frontend editing plugins for WordPress, but these are not as slick as you find them in concrete5. Some CMS'es have frontend editing baked in partially, like a "live preview" ( for CraftCMS :https://craftcms.com/features/live-preview... ). But you still have the form. Some people like a form like this, but I'd rather use the way how concrete5 does it. You can also use concrete5's composer form to have a form to eventually have the blocks fill the page (although you will only see changes after saved and published).

I've looked at other frontend live editing CMS'es, like ImpressPages and Microweber:

http://www.impresspages.org/
http://microweber.com/

These add a lot (and I mean seriously A LOT) of extra HTML to your website, which is not good for your code to text ratio (so not good for search engines).

Just try it out, see if it fits your needs, if not, move on? Or ask in the forums if something can be made! There's always room for more :D

Thanks for your responds, again.
I follow this thread!

Kind Regard,

Alice

I have been using C5 almost exclusively since 2009. I have had several clients switch over from Wordpress to Concrete. Also, I should mention that the US Army is using Concrete5!

Wordpress is a blogging platform that tries to be a CMS. However, Concrete5 is a "build anything" platform.

There are many technical reasons I could get into, as a developer. However, here are some reasons that I was initially sold on Concrete from the beginning:

1. Active community
2. Rapid and active development
3. Ease of use for my clients to edit their own site
4. High quality marketplace addons and themes
5. Lots of flexibility to build any type of project

I am on the PRB (peer review board), which reviews marketplace addons and themes. Unlike Wordpress (or most other open source CMSs), the Concrete marketplace is much higher quality, since there is a tedious review process for every addon and theme. This adds a lot of value to all items - some are free, others are paid. It's well worth it.

Another point I would like to make is that Concrete can even help your site get found! In fact... I have a case study on this!
http://www.pinecreativelabs.com/portfolio/case-studies/sav...

Here is a CMS directory site I built with C5:http://www.cmsguide.info
Don't tell anyone, but it's secretly a way to promote Concrete5!

Choose Concrete5 and make your online presence great again!

Thanks for your extensive reply!
Hoping for more replies.

Kind Regards,

Alice

Wordpress, the "supposedly #1 CMS" in that list, based on the numbers, is one I've looked into extensively. Well here's my take on some facts that few seem to ever talk about.

While the overall percentage of use certainly looks impressive at first glance, I believe the reality is very different. I'm not saying the percentage is "wrong" in the sense of the numbers of sites using Wordpress. Rather, I'm saying the reality is the Wordpress PLATFORM is very FRAGMENTED. You will find there are so many "choices" when you go down the Wordpress route, and the reality is many of these "choices" are really what I would describe as "Sub-platforms". This is in my opinion in part because of features lacking in Wordpress itself. So there are, for example, quite a few competing "Page Builders" (which typically pale in comparison to the Concrete5 in Page Editing). And Wordpress + Sub-Platform A is very different than Wordpress + Sub-Platform B VS Wordpress + Sub-Platform C, etc. And the fact is the percentage of websites or users using any given sub-platform is a tiny fraction of that overall big number, putting any one much more in line (or even well below) the usage of Concrete5. And really, the choice to use any of these sub-platforms is very significant with deep implications (such as how compatibility is impacted, the code that is generated, how a later change is impacted, etc.) In other words, I suggest the better question is not how many sites are using Wordpress, but how many are using Wordpress with Pagebuilder XYZ, VS Wordpress with Pagebuilder BlahBlahBlah, VS Wordpress w/ SuperThemePlatform ABC, VS... and the list REALLY goes on and on.

I also have little doubt that that a vast majority of those who are simply "following the herd" in their choice to use it are clueless (at least initially) to all of the above points and the implications of it all.

I found the differences and implications not only so significantly important, but the number of them mind-numbingly difficult to navigate. I therefore concluded that the entire Wordpress platform was a poor choice in a vast majority of cases, especially in comparison to Concrete5.

OKDnet WOW!! great answer.

WP = jungle of builders and plugins (Each one is separate prouduct)

I always say that WP is the jungle of CSS before "bootstrap and foundation" (The same solution in 1000 ways).

In C5 - one way :)

Thanks. I strongly feel it's an important point to understand.

Having said that, it's too bad most of the "sheeple" who jump on that bandwagon simply because "more people use it than anything else" don't understand this. And so, in reality, they end up using one of these "sub-platforms" which actually has a tiny fraction of the adoption and users!

I agree with all of the foregoing. My take on it:

Pros:
------
Reasonably complete set of blocks (ie, not just a blog requiring add-ins to round it out).

Elegant code, simplifying development and giving confidence in its reliability and security.

In-page editing, and general ease of use (and hence site handover).

Fewer charlatans trying to slap something together or fix something for you (ie, less likelihood of getting ripped off if you pay someone to help you).

Cons:
-------
Poor documentation.

Some long-standing bugs.

Less support than the competition.

Relatively few and expensive add-ons.

You can also take a look at Craft CMS. Awesome CMS and quite a community. Here is their pricing of the CMS itself

http://craftcms.com/pricing

You see, you actually have to charge for the core of the site to actually begin using it (if on a live server that is). So you're down $ 300,00 for just the basics. For concrete5, you don't have to pay a single penny to get started. And I have to admit, both are of outstanding quality. I think you can buy quite some Add-Ons for $ 300,00, and have it do a lot more than this CMS. Of course, you can always use WordPress too, which has plugins that are 99% free lol. Just depends on what you need, what quality you like/require and what options you'd like. You get what you pay for (or what you don't pay for in some cases haha).

And all sales from the marketplace benefit the development of the core concrete5 CMS, keep that in mind. Every sale will have a couple dollars going to pay the developers to keep this project healthy and (a)live. There are multiple marketing plans to do this, and you see they all do it differently. Each has it's own pros and cons!

Just my 2 cents. Wanted to show you there are multiple ways of pricing available.

Also keep in mind that even that tiny little share still represent more than 600,000 websites. That's more than 600,000 websites that found that Concrete5 was the better choice.

Hey!
Thanks all for the replys! My client wants to use Wordpress, because of the many good (and free) Themes and Plugins. He calculated that a site with the some functionality, he would spend 200 euro. Because it's for i non profit organisation he wants to keep the cost low.

Can't blame him. Concrete5 free themes are just a view, and the themes and plugins are view and to expensive.

Kind Regards,

Alice

Lol, another one fallen for WordPress. Abandon the ships!

I hate it when that happens.

I've lost bids on many potential good projects due to Crapress - I mean Wordpress. No matter how many points I make about why C5 is superior, it seems many still aren't convinced simply due to the "everyone else is doing it" or "it's cheaper" mentality.

Lower cost is not always better! Spend $0 on something, how much value do you expect to get out of it?

I do try keep some of my marketplace items free, simply for the reason of trying to get some (new) users to switch to Concrete.

"everyone else is doing it" is not the same as "it's cheaper"

Personally, if the prospect is of the latter kind, I'd rather not get that project. Depending on the difference ratio of course. If the project is going to cost 10x more with C5 because everything needs to be custom developed then I totally understand going with WP.

I would hesitate to recommend C5 for a big e-commerce project.

Now if we're talking a few hundred dollars difference, I'm happier not doing those projects.

Now when it comes to following the majority, well, that's life. But then again successful niches are a thing and C5 is one.

Concrete5 requires far fewer plugins because the core is fully featured. For example, Wordpress almost always requires security and caching plugins, plus plugins for most things that are beyond blogging. While many Wordpress plugins are free, they're also a major source of insecurity.

Ergo, Wordpress's cheap plugins are a necessary evil.

Although I do hate WordPress too, not ALL plugins are insecure or "evil". There are a lot, but just not all haha :)

For sure. I over-simplified/generalised/hyperbolised. :)

I recently switched from wordpress and have no regrets. It was easier to get started with wordpress but much more difficult to achieve my goals in the long run. You may find my first forum post helpful.
https://www.concrete5.org/community/forums/chat/seduced-by-the-dark-...

You mention the cost of themes...they are typically $30-$50 or free. For ~$50 I got excellent tech support and C5 mentoring that was worth far more than the cost of the theme. The same can be said of help received from this forum which is free. There is an excellent video showing how to convert free HTML/CSS themes to C5 themes. I've not mastered this yet but it all seems doable.

The deciding factor in my case is my ability to learn how to create my own C% themes and blocks in the future.

After eight years working mainly with concrete5 we recently spent a rather unpleasant month building a woocommerce site on WordPress.

I can see that for some projects WordPress, a nice looking standard theme and a handful of plugins will be an inexpensive choice. But the low cost comes at the expense of design flexibility (both visually and in content structure), performance, security, ease of ongoing maintenance and future potential.

For a client who wants a professional website that is tightly aligned to their objectives/branding, a flexible modern content management system and scope for whatever future development may become necessary concrete5 is a compelling solution.

We've just put a concrete5 versus WordPress blog post on our website to put the case for concrete5 to potential clients:
http://www.katalysis.net/blogfolio/concrete5-versus-wordpress...

It's also worth saying that building a website in concrete5 can be a rather beautiful experience whereas building a site in WordPress certainly is not.

All thanks for your reponses!
I only do not see why to use concrete5.
Simple things like mod_rewrite do not work.
Gathering is still in beta.
Little and expensive plugins and themes.
I once was very happy with version 6.xx latest
But now it's not upgradeable from 6 to 7.
And the upgrade from version 7, gives many complains.
So many thing do work good in WordPress, and not in Concrete5.
I think the support/community is lacking for Concrete5.
The WordPress core is very basic. I think that Concrete5 must do that to.
Just use (free) plugins, when you want to expand the basic core.
So, this makes a extra solid core because the programmers have a focus.

..

Hello, Community

Does some have the same opinion as me, regarding!

Hey guys,

I have a website that i am working on. I found came across this site in google and would like to start a blog on both of my websites. This is Content Management for Concrete based websites? I have a concrete cutting company and i would like to start putting a blog and content on them.
The website ishttp://www.concretecuttingmelbourne.net.au...

Any information on how to manage the content would be great thanks!

Hello,
The name of this CMS is Concrete5 indeed but it has nothing to do with concrete. It's just a name. You can use it for pretty much anything

Hi. I have an other point of view.

I used to build websites with wordpress. But its just not flexible enough. Some free addons will not be available on long time support. One i used was an entry door for a hacker. This never happened to me on concrete5. I built about 50 sites since then with that system.

You say that mod_rewrite does not work? Mod_rewrite is a server thing and works very well. Has nothing to do with wordpress or conrete5.

Gathering is in beta. But who need this really. Wordpress does not have this either - or i'm wrong?

Upgrade path: You can use version 5.6 - its still supported. Version 7 (5.7) is a completly new cms in my opinion. With lots of technical advantages. But surely not for upgrading.

I had a lot of things that doent work in WordPress. You need a lot of plugins and have to figure out which works best: Caching, SEO, Multilingual, Multlingual Navigation, Language Changer, Visual Composer, Videoblock, Google-Map Block, Teaser-Elements… all built in in concrete5.
For ma that is more solid to have those solutions in the core than as addons. And technically these are addons and not core elements.

Support on concrete5 in the forum was always good and personal. You have to ask clear and friendly. Same on wordpress forums. You don't get everytime an answer if your question is not clear or too general.

I appreciate that concrete5 comes with many built in tools. Thats what i missing in wordpress. You allways have to care every addon is up to date and be careful you do every update. I have a lot of attacks on my 2 wordpress blogs and have to use additional software to protect my sites.

Themes and addons. Yes there are not so much. Thats a big point for wordpress.
Also missing tutorials and help sources are well hidden for concrete5.

concrete5 has the smaller community. You could help here out and write tutorials about concrete5 - perhaps in your blog or somewhere else. Help us grow the community!

Here some things that count most for me when using concrete5 for clients:
- Flexibility in Layout: Flexible Sidebar or Layout in general. Can mix columns and rows.
- Inline Edition on the Layout: Everyone gets this in minutes so you have short schooling times
- The principle of placing blocks is a winner in understanding building content for redactors.
- Multilingual support (i live in a country with 4 languages spoken)
- Simple to use SEO Tool (Metainformations)
- Full page caching built in
- Scalability: You can do really big sites with lot of content. Thats a mess with wordpress in my opinion when you primary need structured sites and not blog-posts.

So these are my thoughts about this system.
Let us work a a community to make things better.

Roland

This is great Roland, thanks for this.

I can add a few further reasons why we've had such great success with concrete5:

- There's quite a nice separation between content and the actual theme/layout. As content is stored in blocks there are some powerful ways that the HTML output can be controlled.

We've got sites that we've re-themed up to _four_ times (due to branding changes or simply because they've wanted to add things like mobile responsiveness). In these cases, we've been able to create new themes, install them and then just switch over to them with little actual massaging of content. As things like editable areas are quite self contained, we've been able to move them around in the process, ensuring they output exactly where we want them.

I actually did a rough little video earlier this year of one these styling updates as an example, but I never uploaded it.
I've done this just now, here's what I'm talking about:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aaMDjX_3Mk...
It's for a 5.6 site, and I didn't really show the original site very well, but it's still a good example of how concrete5's structure gives you such control and it's pretty much the same process in 5.7.

- Being able to easily create block templates also gives us a very high level of control over how content is output. Page lists and autonavs are typically the main things we'll customise, but being able to create a whole range of different variations for a site, where they're directly selectable on the interface is very useful. A client might for example want to have a block template to highlight a particular piece of content, give it different look. We can create a little block template for this purpose, instead of having to ask them to apply a client or, ask them to directly apply styling to some content <shudder>.

We're also with custom block templates able to do quite sophisticated things with data. For something like a page list, where there's a list of pages that can be looped through, custom templates can be used to create sliders, carousels, grids or any kind of display really where you'd linking through to one or more pages - it doesn't just have to be a simple list of pages!

- Attributes are the other main feature that we're always using to solve problems.
Being able to create something like a checkbox or a dropdown to control the behaviour of a page, combined with the composer, allows us to create through only a few lines of code some very powerful controls for our clients.

But with attributes, more complex database style systems can be created, with heavily structured set of data, all without having to actually create custom database tables.
I know that other CMS can do this, but concrete5's attribute system is very solid, especially when you can extend an installed with your own custom attribute types.
(with express coming in v8, this side of things is going to be even more existing)

- concrete5's Advanced Permissions, where you can apply complex permission rules on pages, areas and down to individual blocks is just second to none.
We're able to create sites that dynamically change based on the logged in the logged in user (and their user groups), all through the use of the built in permission controls.
Such controls are great for things like members areas, protected resources, or even just hiding promotional blocks on pages to users that have already logged in.

- The main reason why we picked concrete5 many years ago over something like Wordpress probably came down to the flexibility to add editable areas into a pages.
Instead of there being one monolithic block of page content, with extra areas on a page for 'widgets', we're able to add as many different areas on a page as we need and then _move content freely between them_.

In the past I used to have to wrestle with Joomla's modules - it felt like such a hack that I had to go into the backend and then select the pages I wanted a little bit of additional content to be displayed. In contrast, in concrete5 I can just add some extra content to an extra area on a page while I'm right there on the page. When combined with page templates, layouts and global areas, it all adds to making the ad-hoc requests we'll receive from clients much easier to manage.

I've mentioned perhaps more developer-oriented features, but none of the above really requires knowledge beyond HTML and a few lines of PHP to effectively use. Things like permissions are all handled with the interface. So we find concrete5 a really lovely balance between being a powerful and flexible CMS that suits our arguably higher-end needs, whilst being straightforward for our clients to manage on their end of things.

As a designer, I chose concrete5 as the cms to build websites. I'm not much of a programmer, but having just a little knowledge of php, html and just over basics css plus a little thinking is all you need to build your own themes with concrete5.

I don't know Wordpress. I installed it once after building some sites with concrete5. I'm sure it's good for half the world, but I was lost in the interface; it made me sweat, uninstall Wordpress and go back to concrete5 very fast. ;-)

The big plus after the easiness of building is that clients love this system. They get it! In just one hour. And of course the ease of expanding functionality with the very high quality plugins available on the marketplace (I'll rather pay for add-ons that get support then use free add-ons that lack support).

typoman76:
That's why you have a wordpress site:
http://www.typoblog.ch/

WordPress Rocks!!!

For the rest -10

@typoman76 @mesuva +1 +1

A] 100% control on you code structure (templates, theme).
Example:
Famous scenario - i want gallery.

In WP i need to start download plugin (or pay) from endless list.

In CONCRETE5 - its very easy to change the custom template to any Plugin you wants. Google "js gallery" download the asset i like and change the markup. I have UIkit lightbox, and Lightgallery, and swipe.js, and so on (I choose the right template each time).

B] 100% control on the markup: I add to my galleries Schema.org Markup - easily. All of my pics first on google! because of that :)

In WP its like a jungle of themes and plugins - you can not "Get inside the code" (each plugin build difference)

WP: is "empty" + endless plugins = good product
C5: good product from the start

A+B = speed (You control the code and the assets. My site speed is less than 0.5 second).